From owner-ibis Tue Sep 1 05:25:39 1998 Received: from emcmail.lss.emc.com (emcmail.lss.emc.com [168.159.48.78]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id FAA28194 for ; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 05:25:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fishbowl02.emc.com (fishbowl02.lss.emc.com [168.159.48.62]) by emcmail.lss.emc.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA07626 for ; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 08:20:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fishbowl02.emc.com with VINES-ISMTP; Tue, 1 Sep 98 8:24:42 -0400 Date: Tue, 1 Sep 98 8:18:12 -0400 Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) To: From: "fabrizio zanella" Reply-To: Errors-to: Subject: IBIS to HSPICE X-Incognito-SN: 1467 X-Incognito-Version: 4.11.23 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello to IBIS users everywhere. There are a few gate arrays and bus transceivers for which I can only get IBIS models, HSPICE is not possible. In order to perform a system backplane analysis, though, I need to run the simulations in HSPICE, and need to do this very soon. Does anyone know of a consulting service which provides IBIS to HSPICE conversion, and could do so quickly? Thanks very much, Fabrizio Zanella EMC Corporation fzanella@emc.com 508-435-2075, x4645 From owner-ibis Tue Sep 1 11:40:29 1998 Received: from mail.hyperlynx.com (root@mail.hyperlynx.com [209.20.148.70]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id LAA29359 for ; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 11:40:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tensor ([192.168.148.75]) by mail.hyperlynx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA07026 for ; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 11:36:13 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980901113653.009c9290@mail.nwlink.com> X-Sender: mbflora@mail.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 1998 11:36:53 +0000 To: ibis@eda.org From: Matthew Flora Subject: IBIS Open Forum Minutes 28 Aug 1998 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" DATE: 9/1/98 SUBJECT: 8/28/98 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1998 PARTICIPANTS LIST: AMP (Martin Freedman) Applied Simulation Technology Norio Matsui, Raj Raghuram Cadence Design (& UniCAD) C. Kumar, Don Telian, Patrick Riffault, Craig Lewis, Greg Fitzgerald, Paul Galloway, Patrick Dos Santos, Catherine Weiss, Alain Tribaudot, Geoffrey Ellis*, Todd Westerhoff Compaq Shariq Rahma, Jeff Chu, Greg Edlund*, (Digital Equipment Corp.) Bob Haller Cypress Bruce Wenniger Hewlett Packard (EEsof, etc.) Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu, Paul Gregory High Design Technology Razvan Ene HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli, Matthew Flora* Incases Olaf Rethmeier*, Scott Jacobson, Werner Rissiek Intel Corporation Stephen Peters, Arpad Muranyi*, Frank Kern, (& formerly NCR) Will Hobbs, Prakash Radhakrishnan, Mohammed Hawana, Martin Chang, Dave Moxley Mentor Graphics (Zeelan, Bob Ross*, George Opsahl, Mark Noneman, Interconnectix, etc.) Tom Dagostino, Karine Loudet, Jean Oudinot, Manuel De Almeida, Stephane Rousseau, Neven Orhanovic, Mohamed Mahmoud Mitsubishi Hoang Nguyen, Tam Cao Motorola (Ron Werner) National Semiconductor [Syed Huq], Cheng-Yang Kao, John Goldie, Ikchang Song, Milt Schwartz North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre, Kathy Breda (NESA) NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto) Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Symbios Logic Larry Barnes Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher, Harvey Stiegler, Vincent Chang, Jean-Claude Perrin, Peter Forstner Thomson-CSF Jean-Marc Claveau, Laurent Duzaic, Saverio Lerose, Benoit Meyniel, Jean Lefebvre Viewlogic Jon Powell, Chris Rokusek*, Guy de Burgh, Gary Mandel VeriBest Ian Dodd, David Weins, Ian Gabbitas VLSI Technology D.C. Sessions Zuken-Redac (John Berrie) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1998: Actel Eric Tardif, Emmonvelle Gaudin Aerospatiale Lionel Dreux, Claude Huet Alcatel (Bell, Espace, etc.) John Fitzpatrick, W. Temmerman, Laure Bessettes, Jean-Claude Pourtau, Daniel Peron ALS Design Yves Mouquet Ansoft Eric Bogatin Apple Fred Floresca, Danny Itani Apteq Design Systems Dan FitzPatrick Atmel Ali Baktashian Avanti Nik Bannov CERN Olivier Clere, Jean-Michel Sainson, Rudi Zurbroken Cisco Systems Syed Huq*, Sergio Camerlo*, Irfan Elahi* Crucial Technology Rathna Reddy EIA Patti Rusher EMC Fawn Engelmann, Fabrizio Zanella* ENST, Paris Jean-Jacques Charlot European CAD Standardization Adam Morawiec Intitiative (ECSI) Fairchild Semiconductor Peter LaFlamme H.A.S Electronics Haruny Said IBM Richard Steinle, Kevin Jackson Intracon Design Ltd. Derek Laidlaw Philips Semiconductor Todd Andersen Scottish Electronics Robert Easson Manufacturing Center (SEMC) Seagate Vanessa Howard SGS-Thomson Philippe Lefevre Siemens Gerald Bannert, Bernhard Unger, Christian Marot, Miguel Hernandez, Gil Russell Sun Microsystems Lam Dong, Kevin Ko Symmetry Andy Hughes Tektronix Nassrin Ghahyasi Ultratest International Chris O'Connor Xilinx Susan Wu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode September 18, 1998 (916) 356-9200 1-249623 2581644 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM Syed Huq (past Vice-Chair and formerly of National Semiconductor) called in from Cisco Systems. He is now a signal integrity engineer involved with ASIC design and working for Sergio Camerlo. Sergio Camerlo is manager of the Signal Integrity and Packaging Group at Cisco Systems. He had followed IBIS while at Olivetti. His group is now very interested in using IBIS for their signal integrity work. Irfan Elahi has been with Cisco Systems for nine months. Irfan has years of experience doing signal integrity analysis and getting and using IBIS models. He is particularly interested in how IBIS will support connectors in the future. MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Bob Ross reported that Patti Rusher states no membership or financial change. Syed Huq stated that Cisco Systems plans to become a full IBIS Open Forum member. Syed plans to contact Patti to get an invoice. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S No corrections were noted. The ARs will be discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Syed Huq reports that the Roster has been updated. He also solicited an update to the roster information for Motorola from an additional contact at Motorola. Bob Ross stated that the August 17, 1998 issue of EE Times had a series of articles on high-speed interconnects with an incidental mention of IBIS. Ed Sayre of the IBIS (East) Users Group was on the front page displaying his "fiendish delight at uncovering knotty engineering problems". NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Bob Ross reported that Jon Powell plans to clean up the models directory under eda.org/pub/ibis and remove old subdirectories. Some older Intel models may be retained unless they are publicly available elsewhere on the Intel site. Other models are obsolete or are superceded on company sites. Also, the models link on the official EIA IBIS Web site has been down for a while. Bob is working with Jon on a possible alternative. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES None. INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 2.1) - Patti Rusher reported to Bob Ross that the document has been moved to the ADVC (Draft Approved for Committee Draft With Vote). This is another step leading to a ratification vote. - pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuit (IMIC) - Bob Ross mentioned that he might meet again with the committee chairman Dr. Hideki Fukuda in September, 1998 to discuss plans. - IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation - Bob Ross gave a brief report on a recent document he received titled "Electromagnetic Compatibility, Models of Integrated Circuits for EMI Simulation". This document is to be circulated to the IEC National Committees as a new NWIP (new work item proposal) replacing the IEC 93/67/NP. Its scope is to propose a concept study and behavioral models for simulation of electromagnetic compatibility in emission and susceptibility. The objective is to account for the total electrical activity of an integrated circuit including internal core activity, input/output signal transitions, power supply dynamic currents, and package parasitic elements. Its philosophy is to produce a separate file compatible with IBIS, with the same syntax in an ASCII format. It must be open to evolution and have elements accessible through measurement. The document introduces some concepts and proposes some architectures for emission and susceptibility models. However, it needs to be verified and optimized. - JC-16.2 Subcommittee: Modeling and Test - Bob Ross stated that the joint meeting is still planned for Wednesday, December 9, 1998 in San Diego with the JEDEC JC-42 and JC-16 meetings. Bob expects the initial details will be sent out after the next IBIS telephone meeting. - IEEE Standard Component Data Sheet - No report. Matthew Flora reminded Bob Ross of this agenda item. Bob stated that he is keeping this as an agenda item since Stephen Peters may contact Bob Davis, Chair of the committee to call in to one of our meetings. IBIS (EAST) USERS GROUP MEETINGS Greg Edlund reported on the Accuracy subcommittee meeting held on Thursday, August 27, 1998 at Stratus Computer. The first draft is about one-half complete. The test board is in the PC shop and is expected to be completed shortly. The plan is to prepare a DesignCon paper and also an IBIS Summit presentation in February, 1999. Fabrizio Zanella reported on the Connector group activities. The group has been meeting regularly with representation from connector companies AMP, Teradyne, Berg, and Molex. Also Ansoft and Hyperlynx are contributing. Kellee Chrisafulli is drafting a BIRD for both single and coupled lines. The intent is that connector models have a separate .con file. The BIRD may propose a self-contained document. The subgroup hopes to complete the activity by the end of the year. They are concerned about funding for parser extensions. Fabrizio gave a few details of the thinking for the BIRD. It would cover three-dimensional extensions and handle 1000 pins. However, it is based on using smaller sections and only the significant next pin coupling. Bob Ross mentioned that if the subgroup wishes, they could send out minutes on the IBIS reflectors. Arpad Muranyi asked if coupled matrices were already supported and Bob responded that a single stage of coupled LCR is supported for package models in IBIS Version 2.1 Bob Ross stated that the next IBIS Users group meeting has been rescheduled from Thursday, August 20, 1998 to Thursday, September 3, 1998 at Stratus Computer. OCTOBER 15, 1998 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING PLANS Bob Ross reported that Kathy Breda is coordinating the arrangements. The first meeting notice has been sent out calling for presentations, signups, sponsors, and providing meeting details. The meeting will be held at the Boxboro Holiday Inn (where the first IBIS Users Group meeting was held). It is scheduled all day, and lunch and refreshments will be provided. A two hour IBIS tutorial developed by NESA and TriLogic will be given for review and feedback. Greg Edlund will give a report on the IBIS Accuracy progress for discussion. Fabrizio Zanella will report on the Connector specification status. Bob Ross mentioned that he might give a presentation on using Spice to validate IBIS extensions. Arpad Muranyi expressed interest in the Accuracy issue. Bob noted that this meeting will be held at the same time as the PCB Conference East nearby in Marborough, Massachusetts. All of the face-to-face meetings are held with other meetings of interest to IBIS members since many IBIS participants will be in attendance anyway. Syed Huq asked about an IBIS tutorial at the PCB Conference. Bob noted that it will be conducted the same day as the IBIS meeting. Bob mentioned that Kathy may have a magazine to co-sponsor the meeting. She sent out letters to three other companies to co-sponsor (share the expenses for meeting rental, lunch and refreshments, etc.). Another notice will go out to get participation commitments. EDITING COMMITTEE No Report. The editing committee BNF AR remains. AR - Bob Ross generate and post a BNF for IBIS Version 3.0 (an IBIS Version 3.0 ratification AR). IBISCHK2+ (VER 2.1.17) PROGRESS Bob Ross reported that the source code was delivered. Chris Rokusek compiled (during the meeting) the executables. All bugs except BUG25 and new BUGS29-31 are included in this version. This release supports the official ANSI/EIA-656 standard or IBIS Version 2.1. [Bob uploaded the executables after the meeting, per AR, on eda.org under /pub/ibis/ibschk2+.] Since Syed is now with a company that has not purchased the parser, Bob mentioned that he might consider loaning him the source code to get Linux executables. VERSION 3.1/3.2 PARSER DEVELOPMENT Bob Ross reported that Version 3.1 source code was distributed to those who funded the parser. Chris Rokusek compiled the executables during the meeting. Similar to the ibischk2+ version, BUG25 and new BUGS29-31 were not included. Bob explained that he did not want to hold up the release of executables for BUG25, but that it would be worked on for the ibischk3, Version 3.2 Bob reported that Atul Agarwal plans to deliver the parser during the third or fourth week of September, 1998. He listed several minor errors to the BIRDS being incorporated. Bob corrected the errors in a work in progress ver3_2b.ibs specification which will be uploaded later. [The new ibischk3 executables have been uploaded to eda.org under /pub/ibis/ ibischk3. COOKBOOK No report. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION Matthew Flora reported that he thinks Motorola will submit a model for review. The list of companies still includes Cadence, HyperLynx, Incases, Mentor Graphics, Viewlogic, and Veribest. Matthew said that he needs to send a note to the reflector. His contact address is repeated below: Matthew Flora, HyperLynx mbflora@hyperlynx.com AR - Matthew Flora issue to the IBIS reflector a short writeup on the IBIS IBIS Model Review committee. BIRD53 - Geoffrey Ellis summarized BIRD53 by stating that it basically limited the line terminators to those supported by UNIX (linefeed) and DOS (carriage return, line feed). Geoffrey noted that the 8-bit international character sets supported other terminators. Geoffrey listed a number of problems that could occur if the terminator set were extended. These included inability to print the file, and the inability in some systems to recognize certain terminators. Sun Unix systems can process the international character sets, but the involves setting a new environment variable. Geoffrey supported the limitation as a practical restriction for EDA vendors. Bob Ross asked for the opinions of other EDA vendor participants. Chris Rokusek agreed with the limitation. Bob also supported this limitation because a subset of capability provides a file that is most easily used by everyone. Matthew Flora also supported this position. Olaf Rethmeier presented a European perspective that EDA vendors must consider the US market. So he also supported BIRD53. Matthew raised some concerns on the wording of the BIRD53 changes. The reference to C language \n and \n\r characters was unnecessary. Also, it was not clear whether the character set limitation applied to just terminators or to all characters. Arpad Muranyi noted that other developers might want to include comments in their native languages. However, the information might be garbled when processed using another character set. Bob noted that he wanted BIRD53 to focus only on the termination issue. In practice the comment and text characters are not a real issue. Matthew noted that the text of BIRD53 could be interpreted narrowly to include limiting comments in native languages. Bob indicated that the general consensus was to approve BIRD53. However, the wording details needed to be resolved. Matthew and Geoffry should work out the acceptable language and issue BIRD53.1 for a vote at the next meeting. AR - Geoffrey Ellis and Matthew Flora to work out the technical wording changes for accuracy and clarity and submit BIRD 53.1 by Friday, September 4, 1998 so that it can be voted on at the next meeting. BUG29 - \n, \r. \r\n Line Terminators Need to be Handled Bob Ross indicated that based on the sense of the committee, BUG29 will be closed with Will Not Fix. (This will be finalized if BIRD53.1 is approved.) BUG30 - [Pin Mapping] Checks are too Simplistic Bob Ross noted that Atul Agarwal plans to include a fix to BUG30 in the next ibischk3 parser release. The current set of tests do not look at the bus connection restrictions that are documented in the specification. BUG31 - Error for [Pulldown] Decreasing Current Should be Warning Bob Ross had some concerns about some of the data in BUG31. However, he deferred discussion since he had not looked at the details. So the action remains to research BUG31 further before proposing any change to the ibischk3 parser. INPUT ENHANCEMENTS Bob Ross briefly noted that input specification enhancements are possible by adding subparameters to the [Model Spec] keyword. He noted that comments have appeared occasionally over the past year on subparameters. Also some new Input parameters for duration during input transition are needed. There have been several reflector comments on the need for more additional specification parameters in the last year. Bob noted that all [Model] subparameters could be expressed in a typ-min-max format under [Model Spec], similar to Vinh and Vinl. Bob also noted that some more advanced input considerations relate to SSO (as suggested by D.C. Sessions) might be included later as a Version 4.X enhancement. Bob noted that he might propose a BIRD on this. However, such a BIRD could be disruptive for those vendors implementing IBIS Version 3.1 functionality. NEXT MEETING: The next meeting will be on Friday, September 18, 1998 from 8:00 AM to 10:00 AM. BIRD53.1 is scheduled for a vote. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentorg.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix BU of Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 VICE CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515 sjpeters@ichips.intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF1-56 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, Oregon 97124-5961 SECRETARY: Matthew Flora (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 mbflora@hyperlynx.com Senior Engineer, HyperLynx, Inc. 17641 NE 67th Court Redmond, WA 98052 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Senior Scientist, Viewlogic (formerly Quad Design) 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, & /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ============================================================================== From owner-ibis Tue Sep 1 17:02:27 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id RAA29971 for ; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 17:02:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id QAA03792; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 16:57:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id QAA16927; Tue, 1 Sep 1998 16:57:51 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA20334; Tue, 1 Sep 98 16:57:50 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Sep 98 16:57:50 PDT Message-Id: <9809012357.AA20334@bob> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: IBIS BIRD53.1 - IBIS FIle Character Set To All: Below is BIRD53.1 from Geoffrey Ellis (with assistance from Matthew Flora). This will be scheduled for a vote at the September 18, 1998 meeting. Bob Ross Mentor Graphics Buffer Issue Resolution Document (BIRD) BIRD ID#: 53.1 ISSUE TITLE: IBIS File Character Set REQUESTER: Geoffrey Ellis at Cadence Design Systems DATE SUBMITTED: August 7, 1998, September 1, 1998 DATE ACCEPTED BY IBIS OPEN FORUM: Pending ******************************************************************************* ******************************************************************************* STATEMENT OF THE ISSUE: While the general syntax rules and guidelines say, "The file must have no more than 80 characters per line," the rules do not say which character sequences are legal to terminate a line, e.g. carriage return followed by a linefeed character, etc. Also, the Specification does not say whether or not the line termination character(s) count against the 80 character limit. The Specification also does not state which characters are legal in an IBIS file, other than that it is an ASCII file. Although ASCII is a 7-bit code ("US-ASCII. Coded Character Set - 7-Bit American Standard Code for Information Interchange. Standard ANSI X3.4-1986, ANSI, 1986"), some published standards make reference to "8-bit ASCII characters", for example "File Transfer Protocol RFC 542 NIC 17759". The International Standards Organization has published ISO-8859, a group of 8-bit character sets, for use in different regions of the world. Each of these character sets is a super set of ASCII, using codes greater than hexadecimal 07F to represent accented or local characters. The IBIS Specification should make clear that neither extended character sets, such as those defined in ISO-8859, nor ASCII controls (other than tabs and line terminators) are allowed in an IBIS file. ******************************************************************************* STATEMENT OF THE RESOLVED SPECIFICATIONS: The "General Syntax Rules and Guidelines" section contains 13 numbered items, including item 4 which states: 4) The file must have no more than 80 characters per line. We propose to modify item 4, and to add item 14, as follows: 4) A line of the file may have at most 80 characters, followed by a line termination sequence. The line termination sequence must be one of the following two sequences: a linefeed character, or a carriage return followed by linefeed character. 14) Only ASCII characters, as defined in ANSI Standard X3.4-1986, may be used in an IBIS file. The use of characters with codes greater than hexadecimal 07F is not allowed. Also, ASCII control characters (those numerically less than hexadecimal 20) are not allowed, except for tabs or in a line termination sequence. As mentioned in item 10 above, the use of tab characters is discouraged. ******************************************************************************* ANALYSIS PATH/DATA THAT LED TO SPECIFICATION: At the lowest level of detail, the IBIS Specification needs to say which characters are legal, and what constitutes a "line". ASCII files produced in a Microsoft/PC environment have lines which end with a carriage return followed by a linefeed character, while ASCII files produced on UNIX have lines which end with a linefeed character. An IBIS parser should accept either line termination sequence, regardless of the environment in which the parser runs. Any other line termination sequence should be ruled out. Use of an ISO-8859 extended character set might improve model readability in the region of the world where the model was produced, but would make the IBIS file less readable in other regions. The ASCII code, which is a subset of each of the ISO-8859 character sets, is the subset which is readable across all of the regions. ******************************************************************************* ANY OTHER BACKGROUND INFORMATION: ******************************************************************************* From owner-ibis Wed Sep 9 04:46:13 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id EAA29521 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 04:46:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from serv1.ger.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id EAA06142; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 04:41:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from norbertw-laptp.ger.mentorg.com by serv1.ger.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.40H) id NAA29264; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 13:45:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980909124526.00727e3c@mailhost.ger.mentorg.com> X-Sender: norbertw@mailhost.ger.mentorg.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 12:45:26 +0200 To: ibis@vhdl.org From: Norbert Wellnitz Subject: Serial Diodes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all, is there any idea how to model seriel diodes ( no terminator ) and to get them in with the correct polarity ? Any idea is welcome. Mit freundlichem Gruss Norbert Wellnitz Mit freundlichem Gruss Norbert Wellnitz ========================================= Mentor Graphics (Deutschland) GmbH Education & Training Department Tel. +49 (0) 89 57096-0 Fax +49 (0) 89 57096-455 e-mail: norbert_wellnitz@mentorg.com ========================================= +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Have a look on http://www.mentorg.com/germany/training +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-ibis Wed Sep 9 08:28:44 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id IAA29991 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 08:28:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id IAA21994; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 08:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id IAA15517; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 08:24:03 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA29710; Wed, 9 Sep 98 08:24:02 PDT Date: Wed, 9 Sep 98 08:24:02 PDT Message-Id: <9809091524.AA29710@bob> To: ibis@eda.org, norbert_wellnitz@mentorg.com Subject: Re: Serial Diodes Norbert: IBIS Version 3.1 contains the [Series Current] keyword which is designed for modeling non-linear series elements such as series diodes. Since [Series Current] is a series element, the [Series Pin Mapping] keyword can be used to assign pins to it with the correct polarity. Best Regards, Bob Ross Interconnectix/Mentor Graphics > Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 12:45:26 +0200 > To: ibis@vhdl.org > From: Norbert Wellnitz > Subject: Serial Diodes > Hi all, > is there any idea how to model seriel diodes ( no terminator ) and to get > them in with the > correct polarity ? > Any idea is welcome. > Mit freundlichem Gruss > Norbert Wellnitz > Mit freundlichem Gruss > Norbert Wellnitz > ========================================= > Mentor Graphics (Deutschland) GmbH > Education & Training Department > Tel. +49 (0) 89 57096-0 > Fax +49 (0) 89 57096-455 > e-mail: norbert_wellnitz@mentorg.com > ========================================= > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Have a look on http://www.mentorg.com/germany/training > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-ibis Wed Sep 9 14:34:42 1998 Received: from mailext02.compaq.com (mailext02.compaq.com [207.18.199.33]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with SMTP id OAA01057 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 14:34:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailext02.compaq.com by mailext02.compaq.com via smail with esmtp id for ; Wed, 9 Sep 98 14:27:14 -0500 (CDT) (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.9 built 21-jan-98) Received: from mail.compaq.com([207.18.199.32]) by mailext02.compaq.com with SMTP (peer mailint01.compaq.com[207.18.199.34]) id rcv008499; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 14:27:05 -0500 (CDT) Received: from lisbon.eng.hou.compaq.com(really [131.168.159.105]) by mail.compaq.com via sendmail with smtp id for ; Wed, 9 Sep 98 14:29:00 -0500 (CDT) (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.10 built 18-dec-97) Received: by lisbon.eng.hou.compaq.com (Smail3.1.26.7/COMPAQ-HESIOD) id m0zGpv1-000KyfC; Wed, 9 Sep 98 14:28 CDT Message-Id: Date: Wed, 9 Sep 98 14:28 CDT From: beal@lisbon.eng.hou.compaq.com (Weston Beal) To: ariazi@anigma.com Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] : IBIS Model Verification Cc: ibis@eda.org > From silab.Eng.Sun.COM!owner-si-list Wed Sep 9 14:01:02 1998 > From: Abe Riazi > To: "'si-list@silab.eng.sun.com'" > Subject: [SI-LIST] : IBIS Model Verification > Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 11:21:48 -0700 > Hi Everyone, > ... CHOP ... > Before using an IBIS model in a simulation, first I check the model for > possible syntax /format errors using > the ibis_chk program, followed by an examination of the I-V data and > rise/fall times for monotonic behavior (with > the aid of the Visual IBIS Editor software). However, this level of > evaluation can prove insufficient in some cases. > > Therefore, I am interested to learn about procedures and tools which > allow a comprehensive verification of an > IBIS model, thereby minimizing the possibility of unreliable simulation > results. > Abe, Valid point! I am an IBIS consumer too. And I'm getting tired of messy, incomplete, and blatantly wrong IBIS files. I do the same as you. I run ibis_chk and then look at each VI and VT curve with ibisplot. About 90% of the files I receive require some fixing on my side. It appears that many people are creating IBIS files with very little understanding of the specification. Just because s2ibis ran without errors does not guarantee a good IBIS file! I think the best we can do right now is to tell the suppliers about the errors that we find in their files. Most of them want to learn how to do it right, and will gladly accept suggestions when presented tactfully. Here are some of the flags I look for: s2ibis 0.91BETA (!!! WARNING !!!) no Vmeas, Cref, Rref, or Vref clamp curves left in pullup and pulldown (s2ibis) pullup and pulldown curves not crossing 0,0 2 significant digits (s2ibis) causing stairstep curves I don't want to take away from the massive amount of work done in developing s2ibis. It can be a great tool if you know how to use it. Don't just run it without understanding what it does. I changed some things I didn't like in the code and use it internally when I have spice models. I was saying just yesterday that we need an ibis_fix program to look for the common errors and try to fix them. EDUCATION is the only real answer. Regards, Weston Beal > Thank you in advance for your response. > > Best Regards, > > Abe Riazi > SI Engineer > Anigma, Inc. From owner-ibis Wed Sep 9 18:52:41 1998 Received: from ganymede.or.intel.com (ganymede.or.intel.com [134.134.248.3]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id SAA01472 for ; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:52:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ichips-jf.jf.intel.com (ichips-jf.jf.intel.com [134.134.50.200]) by ganymede.or.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA11832; Thu, 10 Sep 1998 01:48:31 GMT Received: from xtg801.pdx.intel.com (xtg801.pdx.intel.com [134.134.120.169]) by ichips-jf.jf.intel.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07768; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:48:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ichips.intel.com by xtg801.pdx.intel.com (8.8.8/WW2.2 (Jones Farm)) id SAA28739; Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:48:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199809100148.SAA28739@xtg801.pdx.intel.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0delta 6/3/97 To: beal@lisbon.eng.hou.compaq.com (Weston Beal) cc: ariazi@anigma.com, ibis@eda.org, si-list@silab.eng.sun.com Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] : IBIS Model Verification In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 09 Sep 1998 14:28:00 CDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 18:48:29 -0700 From: Stephen Peters Hello Weston, others: I might mention that the IBIS open forum has recognized this problem of incomplete/messy models and has established an informal model review program. It's basic purpose is to provide feedback to the model creators on what they did or didn't do correctly. If you receive an IBIS model that you think is in error and want to have it checked out send it to Matthew Flora at mbflora@hyperlynx.com. Several EDA vendors that support IBIS have volunteered to give submitted models the once over -- including running them with their simulators. (Obviously, if your model is unreleased or otherwise confidential you will need to obtain the proper NDAs...see Matthew for details). I hope this helps. Regards, Stephen Peters Intel Corp. Vice Chair EIA-IBIS Open Forum > Abe, > > Valid point! I am an IBIS consumer too. And I'm getting tired of > messy, incomplete, and blatantly wrong IBIS files. I do the same as > you. I run ibis_chk and then look at each VI and VT curve with > ibisplot. About 90% of the files I receive require some fixing on my > side. It appears that many people are creating IBIS files with very > little understanding of the specification. Just because s2ibis ran > without errors does not guarantee a good IBIS file! I think the best > we can do right now is to tell the suppliers about the errors that we > find in their files. Most of them want to learn how to do it right, > and will gladly accept suggestions when presented tactfully. > > Here are some of the flags I look for: > s2ibis 0.91BETA (!!! WARNING !!!) > no Vmeas, Cref, Rref, or Vref > clamp curves left in pullup and pulldown (s2ibis) > pullup and pulldown curves not crossing 0,0 > 2 significant digits (s2ibis) causing stairstep curves > > I don't want to take away from the massive amount of work done in > developing s2ibis. It can be a great tool if you know how to use it. > Don't just run it without understanding what it does. I changed some > things I didn't like in the code and use it internally when I have > spice models. > > I was saying just yesterday that we need an ibis_fix program to look > for the common errors and try to fix them. EDUCATION is the only real > answer. > > Regards, > Weston Beal > > > Thank you in advance for your response. > > > > Best Regards, > > > > Abe Riazi > > SI Engineer > > Anigma, Inc. From owner-ibis Thu Sep 10 10:14:30 1998 Received: from mail.hyperlynx.com (root@mail.hyperlynx.com [209.20.148.70]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id KAA03692 for ; Thu, 10 Sep 1998 10:14:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kellee98 ([192.168.148.110]) by mail.hyperlynx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA23704; Thu, 10 Sep 1998 10:09:05 -0700 Message-Id: <199809101709.KAA23704@mail.hyperlynx.com> X-Sender: kellee@mail.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 10:09:04 -0700 To: Stephen Peters , beal@lisbon.eng.hou.compaq.com (Weston Beal) From: Kellee Crisafulli Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] : IBIS Model Verification (correction) Cc: ariazi@anigma.com, ibis@eda.org, si-list@silab.eng.sun.com In-Reply-To: <199809100148.SAA28739@xtg801.pdx.intel.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by server.eda.org id KAA03693 Hi Weston, Stephen, I need to modify a statement made by Stephen. The "Free" IBIS model review is NOT for CAE users. It was setup to assist model developers at the IC house with their models. We DO NOT have the bandwidth to check models submitted by users of all the CAE tools in the world. We DO have the bandwidth to check models submitted by the IC houses. If we had more volunteers we could expand this program into users. I suggest a user network be created powered by other users that volunteer. The "IBIS open user forum" At 06:48 PM 9/9/98 -0700, Stephen Peters wrote: > >Hello Weston, others: > > I might mention that the IBIS open forum has recognized this problem >of incomplete/messy models and has established an informal model review >program. It's basic purpose is to provide feedback to >the model creators on what they did or didn't do correctly. If you receive >an IBIS model that you think is in error and want to have it checked out >send it to Matthew Flora at mbflora@hyperlynx.com. Several EDA vendors that >support IBIS have volunteered to give submitted models the once over -- >including running them with their simulators. (Obviously, if your model is >unreleased or otherwise confidential you will need to obtain the proper >NDAs...see Matthew for details). > >I hope this helps. > > Regards, > Stephen Peters > Intel Corp. > Vice Chair EIA-IBIS Open Forum > > > >> Abe, >> >> Valid point! I am an IBIS consumer too. And I'm getting tired of >> messy, incomplete, and blatantly wrong IBIS files. I do the same as >> you. I run ibis_chk and then look at each VI and VT curve with >> ibisplot. About 90% of the files I receive require some fixing on my >> side. It appears that many people are creating IBIS files with very >> little understanding of the specification. Just because s2ibis ran >> without errors does not guarantee a good IBIS file! I think the best >> we can do right now is to tell the suppliers about the errors that we >> find in their files. Most of them want to learn how to do it right, >> and will gladly accept suggestions when presented tactfully. >> >> Here are some of the flags I look for: >> s2ibis 0.91BETA (!!! WARNING !!!) >> no Vmeas, Cref, Rref, or Vref >> clamp curves left in pullup and pulldown (s2ibis) >> pullup and pulldown curves not crossing 0,0 >> 2 significant digits (s2ibis) causing stairstep curves >> >> I don't want to take away from the massive amount of work done in >> developing s2ibis. It can be a great tool if you know how to use it. >> Don't just run it without understanding what it does. I changed some >> things I didn't like in the code and use it internally when I have >> spice models. >> >> I was saying just yesterday that we need an ibis_fix program to look >> for the common errors and try to fix them. EDUCATION is the only real >> answer. >> >> Regards, >> Weston Beal >> >> > Thank you in advance for your response. >> > >> > Best Regards, >> > >> > Abe Riazi >> > SI Engineer >> > Anigma, Inc. > --------------------------------------------------------- Have a great day.... Kellee Crisafulli at HyperLynx SI,EMC,X-talk and IBIS tools for the Windows platform E-mail: web:   --------------------------------------------------------- From owner-ibis Fri Sep 11 11:39:17 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id LAA08043 for ; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:39:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id LAA11398; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:34:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id LAA09246; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:34:38 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA06566; Fri, 11 Sep 98 11:34:39 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Sep 98 11:34:39 PDT Message-Id: <9809111834.AA06566@bob> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: IBIS Meeting AGENDA 9/18/98 IBIS Open Forum Meeting Agenda for 9/18/98 Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode (916) 356-9200 1-249623 2581644 All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the Reservation Number and Passcode. 8:00 Check-In, Intros, Announcements Ross - Intros of New IBIS Participants, Meeting Quorum Ross - Membership Update and Treasurers Report Rusher - Review of Previous Meeting's Minutes (and ARs) Ross - Miscellany/Announcements All - Press & Web Page Updates Huq, All - New Models Available, Library Update Powell, All - Opens for New Issues All 8:25 Administrative and Project Discussions International/External Progress - IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 2.1) Rusher - pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) Raghuram - 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation Perrin - JEDEC JC-16.2 Modeling and Testing Sessions - IEEE Standard Component Data Sheet Davis/Peters/Ross IBIS (East) Users Group Meetings Edlund IBISEAST SUMMIT Ross/Breda IBISCHK Parsers Ross/Rokusek Version 3.1/3.2 Parser Development Ross - Executables - Version 3.2 Document - Version 3.2 Parser Development Cookbook Status Peters IBIS Model Review Committee Flora New Administrative Issues All 9:00 Technical Discussion BIRD53 - IBIS File Character Set (Vote) Ellis BUG29 - n\, \r, \r\n Line Terminators Need to be Ellis Handled BUG31 - Error for [Pulldown Decreasing Current Should Ross be Warning (more discussion) IBIS Reflector Issues All New Technical Issues All 9:50 Wrap Up and Next Meetings Plans Peters 9:55 Sign Off From owner-ibis Fri Sep 11 12:54:32 1998 Received: from ferrari.Colorado.EDU (cpadilla@ferrari.Colorado.EDU [128.138.189.225]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id MAA08221 for ; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:54:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from cpadilla@localhost) by ferrari.Colorado.EDU (8.8.8/8.8.7/UnixOps/Hesiod/(SDM)) id NAA06816 for ibis@eda.org; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:50:25 -0600 (MDT) From: Chris Padilla Message-Id: <199809111950.NAA06816@ferrari.Colorado.EDU> Subject: Unsubscribe To: ibis@eda.org Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:50:24 MDT X-Mailer: Elm [revision: 212.2] From owner-ibis Thu Sep 17 06:06:51 1998 Received: from bastion.systems.gec.com (bastion.systems.gec.com [198.6.251.2]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id GAA23211 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 06:06:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailswitch.systems.gec.com ([198.6.251.7]) by bastion.systems.gec.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id JAA27999 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:02:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mailgate.systems.gec.com (mailgate.systems.gec.com [10.192.192.16]) by mailswitch.systems.gec.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA09527 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 08:05:48 -0400 Received: from pcmail.systems.gec.com (pcmail.systems.gec.com [10.200.4.99]) by mailgate.systems.gec.com with ESMTP (8.7.1/8.7.1) id JAA26828 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:02:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: by pcmail.systems.gec.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:02:30 -0400 Message-ID: <1BB921E92C3BD111A1ED006008133CB142A288@gec024.systems.gec.com> From: "Arici, Giuseppe" To: "'ibis@eda.org'" Subject: Unsubscribe Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:02:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain From owner-ibis Thu Sep 17 14:36:30 1998 Received: from wile.nesa.com ([204.240.29.30]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id OAA24232; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 14:36:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mail@localhost) by wile.nesa.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA18631; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:11:09 -0400 Received: from porky.nesa.com(204.240.29.45) by wile.nesa.com via smap (V1.3) id sma018625; Thu Sep 17 17:11:05 1998 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980917171056.006ce394@mail.nesa.com> X-Sender: breda@mail.nesa.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:10:56 -0400 To: ibis-users@eda.org, ibis@eda.org, si-list@silab.Eng.Sun.COM From: Kathy Breda Subject: IBIS Summit Agenda - Thurs. 10/15/98 - Can You Attend? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings: The October 15th IBIS Summit is rapidly approaching. The themes of this meeting are IBIS education and "real-life" usage of IBIS models. Below is a proposed agenda for the upcoming meeting. We will not be turning away any presentations or case studies - so don't hesitate to contact me with an idea! (breda@nesa.com) We're looking for your assistance---+ | v ACTIONS (respond to breda@nesa.com) * Please let me know if you are attending the summit so that arrangements can be finalized at the meeting site. * Would you be interested in setting up a software demonstration? Purpose is to provide attendees the opportunity to look at the different IBIS tools available. * We're looking for more IBIS case studies to be presented. * We're looking for more presentations to be presented. * Are you interested in attending the golf outing after the meeting? Should be fun, but let us know if you can join us. Proposed IBIS Summit Agenda - subject to change Thursday, October 15, 1998, 8:30 - 4:00 Boxboro Holiday Inn, Boxboro, Massachusetts During breaks and lunch we would like to have IBIS software tools demonstrated in the back of the meeting room for the attendees to view. 8:30 A.M. Refreshments and informal gathering 9:00 Welcome, Introductions of participants Ed Sayre NESA 9:15 General IBIS business Bob Ross Mentor/Interconnectix 9:30 IBIS tutorial Ed Sayre/Joe Socha/TBD 10:30 15 minute break 10:45 Continue with IBIS tutorial 11:30 IBIS Connector Model Definition BIRD Fabrizio Zanella EMC Corporation 12:00 P.M. Lunch 1:00 Case Study Panel - Using IBIS Models Behavioral/IBIS modeling of a FET bus Tay Ansari switch using Cadence tools Sun Microsystems Measurement and simulations using various Fabrizio Zanella Tools demonstrating and comparing 1) Measurements 2) Spice using spice model 2) vendors "A" and "B" using IBIS models IBIS Accuracy Specification Robert Haller Compaq Computer Corp. IBIS Accuracy Test Board Peter Laflamme Fairchild Semiconductor Comparison between SPICE and IBIS Jinhua Chen I/O device simulations NESA MORE CASE STUDIES APPRECIATED! 2:00 Break 2:15 Using SPICE to Validate IBIS keywords Bob Ross 3:15 PRESENTATION NEEDED! 3:45 Business Wrap-up 4:00 IBIS Summit Golf Outing - Cyprian Keys Golf Club (20 minutes from meeting location) Greens Fee ($12) to be paid by golfer. This is a Par 3, nine hole course, located twenty minutes from the meeting location. 284 East Temple St Bolyston MA 01505 508-869-9900 http://features.yahoo.com/golfcourses/ma/boylston/20864.html +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ | NORTH EAST SYSTEMS ASSOCIATES, INC. | | ------------------------------------- | | "High Performance Engineering & Design" | +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ | Kathy Breda e-mail: breda@nesa.com | | NESA, Inc. http://www.nesa.com/ | | 636 Great Road Tel +1.978.897-8787 | | Stow, MA 01775 USA Fax +1.978.897-5359 | +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ From owner-ibis Thu Sep 17 17:06:05 1998 Received: from relayhost.vlsi.com (relayhost.vlsi.com [134.27.20.23]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id RAA24458 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:06:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smtp@localhost) by relayhost.vlsi.com (SMI-8.6/) id RAA11306 for ; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:01:26 -0700 Received: from (tem-pbx1.tempe.vlsi.com [134.27.128.26]) by osiris.vlsi.com via smap (V2.0) id xma011300; Thu, 17 Sep 98 17:01:16 -0700 Received: from vlsi.com (witsend.tempe.vlsi.com [134.27.133.12]) by tem-pbx1.tempe.vlsi.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) id SXTH7CH7; Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:01:11 -0700 Sender: dsession@vlsi.com Message-ID: <3601A2CC.1812FA52@vlsi.com> Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 17:01:16 -0700 From: "D. C. Sessions" Organization: VLSI Technology Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4m) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: IBIS Mailing list Subject: JC-16 News Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At this week's meeting of JC-16 and JC-42 (memory standards) IBM presented the results of a survey of V/I curves (from IBIS!) from several DDR SDRAM vendors. Not a lot of agreement. After some discussion there was a vote and it was decided to go to ballot with an amendment to the SSTL specification to include envelope specs -- in IBIS format. Milestone. The next day, the JC-42 committee agreed to go forward with a detailed data-sheet format composition of the DDR SDRAM standard, to incorporate several detailed electrical specs including maximum and minimum pin capacitance. The working group has provisionally decided to publish the electrical specs as a full IBIS model of a compliant memory part. There was a GREAT deal of ignorance as to what IBIS is, what it can and can't do, etc. Many of the vendors doubted that their engineering groups could produce a robust IBIS model or verify a sample part against a specification model (sounds like a business opportunity.) I mentioned to several of the vendors the posibility of acquiring the model generation tools that Hyperlynx has so graciously made available. One of the key functions of the DDR SDRAM spec depends on FET switches for load isolation in large systems. I pointed out that IBIS can now model these devices, which was news to the TI member there, one Mr. Stephen M. Nolan mailto:s-nolan1@ti.com who would like to hear from EDA vendors about support for FET switch models; he'll pass on the contact to the interested parties within TI. Several of these issues will be coming up for vote at the joint December meeting; I want to *strongly* encourage our members to appear in force as it looks like a priceless opportunity to educate some very influential people about IBIS at a time when they are setting standards. Not a bad marketing opportunity, either, if it comes to that. -- D. C. Sessions dc.sessions@vlsi.com From owner-ibis Fri Sep 18 14:28:04 1998 Received: from mail-gw.pacbell.net (mail-gw.pacbell.net [206.13.28.25]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id OAA27002 for ; Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:28:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pacbell.net (ppp-209-79-182-200.vntrcs.pacbell.net [209.79.182.200]) by mail-gw.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1+antispam) with ESMTP id OAA13354; Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:23:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3602CE75.B1054EFD@pacbell.net> Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:19:49 -0700 From: Jon Powell Reply-To: jonp@qdt.com Organization: Viewlogic Consulting Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en]C-PBI-NC404 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ibis@vhdl.org Subject: model page update. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From the OFFICE of the LIBRARIAN, The IBIS model page has been put back on-line and updated with all of the requests that have been sent in over the last few months. You may note that a large number of previously mentioned pages are either no-longer working or have had the ibis models removed (or just moved). If anyone knows where they went, please drop me a line. I have much better access to this new web page and it is easier for me to do updates so let me know. Comments and Suggestions to: jon@pacbell.net Complaints to: BitBucket@have_a_nice_day.org regards, jon From owner-ibis Mon Sep 21 14:06:26 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id OAA01745; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 14:06:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id OAA23500; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 14:01:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id OAA01293; Mon, 21 Sep 1998 14:01:32 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA18478; Mon, 21 Sep 98 14:01:31 PDT Date: Mon, 21 Sep 98 14:01:31 PDT Message-Id: <9809212101.AA18478@bob> To: atulapt@giascl01.vsnl.net.in Subject: Re: Add Submodel Cc: ibis@eda.org, ibischk-bug@eda.org Atul: I had to think about your question. My initial intent was that each submodel be called once. However, multiple calls of the same model are not prohibited in the draft specification, and multilple calls are consistent with how subcircuits or subroutines operate. So calls to the same submodel should be allowed for all the cases you show below. I have comments for each case in your text below. I have copied this to the IBIS reflector in case there any concerns or comments on this interpretation. Best Regards, Bob Ross > Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 22:23:06 +0000 (GMT) > From: "APT SOFTWARE AVENUES PVT.LTD" > To: Bob Ross > Subject: Add Submodel > Hello Bob > Within an [Add Submodel] there can be repetitions of the same sub model, > right ? > [Add Submodel] > sub1 Driving > sub1 Non-driving Could be done more efficiently with one sub1 and the All mode. > How about > [Add Submodel] > sub1 Driving > sub1 Driving | a repetition This could be used as a simple way of testing a double strength model sub1 (such as a dynamic clamp at double strength without creating double strength IV tables). > How about > [Add Submodel] > sub1 Driving > sub1 All Here sub1 is single strength in Non-driving mode and double strength in the Driving mode. > (Assume that the model type is appropriate) > --- atul From owner-ibis Thu Sep 24 10:01:28 1998 Received: from mail.hyperlynx.com (root@mail.hyperlynx.com [209.20.148.70]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id KAA11050 for ; Thu, 24 Sep 1998 10:01:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tensor ([192.168.148.75]) by mail.hyperlynx.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA01830 for ; Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:57:02 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980924095708.0093fe20@mail.nwlink.com> X-Sender: mbflora@mail.nwlink.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:57:08 +0000 To: ibis@eda.org From: Matthew Flora Subject: IBIS Open Forum Minutes 18 Sep 1998 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" DATE: 9/24/98 SUBJECT: 9/18/98 EIA IBIS Open Forum Minutes VOTING MEMBERS AND 1998 PARTICIPANTS LIST: AMP (Martin Freedman) Applied Simulation Technology Norio Matsui, Raj Raghuram* Cadence Design (& UniCAD) C. Kumar, Don Telian, Patrick Riffault, Craig Lewis, Greg Fitzgerald, Paul Galloway, Patrick Dos Santos, Catherine Weiss, Alain Tribaudot, Geoffrey Ellis*, Todd Westerhoff Compaq Shariq Rahma, Jeff Chu, [Greg Edlund], (Digital Equipment Corp.) Bob Haller* Cypress Bruce Wenniger Hewlett Packard (EEsof, etc.) Karl Kachigan, Henry Wu, Paul Gregory High Design Technology Razvan Ene HyperLynx Kellee Crisafulli, Matthew Flora* Incases Olaf Rethmeier, Scott Jacobson, Werner Rissiek Intel Corporation Stephen Peters*, Arpad Muranyi*, Frank Kern*, (& formerly NCR) Will Hobbs, Prakash Radhakrishnan, Mohammed Hawana, Martin Chang, Dave Moxley LSI Logic (Symbios Logic) Larry Barnes* Mentor Graphics (Zeelan, Bob Ross*, George Opsahl, Mark Noneman, Interconnectix, etc.) Tom Dagostino, Karine Loudet, Jean Oudinot, Manuel De Almeida, Stephane Rousseau, Neven Orhanovic, Mohamed Mahmoud Mitsubishi Hoang Nguyen, Tam Cao Motorola (Ron Werner) National Semiconductor Cheng-Yang Kao, John Goldie, Ikchang Song, Milt Schwartz* North East Systems Associates Edward Sayre, Kathy Breda (NESA) NEC (Hiroshi Matsumoto) Quantic EMC (Mike Ventham) Texas Instruments Thomas Fisher, Harvey Stiegler, Vincent Chang, Jean-Claude Perrin, Peter Forstner Thomson-CSF Jean-Marc Claveau, Laurent Duzaic, Saverio Lerose, Benoit Meyniel, Jean Lefebvre Viewlogic Jon Powell, Chris Rokusek*, Guy de Burgh, Gary Mandel VeriBest Ian Dodd, David Weins, Ian Gabbitas VLSI Technology D.C. Sessions* Zuken-Redac (John Berrie) OTHER PARTICIPANTS IN 1998: Actel Eric Tardif, Emmonvelle Gaudin Aerospatiale Lionel Dreux, Claude Huet Alcatel (Bell, Espace, etc.) John Fitzpatrick, W. Temmerman, Laure Bessettes, Jean-Claude Pourtau, Daniel Peron ALS Design Yves Mouquet Ansoft Eric Bogatin Apple Fred Floresca, Danny Itani Apteq Design Systems Dan FitzPatrick Atmel Ali Baktashian Avanti Nik Bannov CERN Olivier Clere, Jean-Michel Sainson, Rudi Zurbroken Cisco Systems Syed Huq*, Sergio Camerlo, Irfan Elahi Crucial Technology Rathna Reddy EIA Patti Rusher EMC Fawn Engelmann, Fabrizio Zanella ENST, Paris Jean-Jacques Charlot European CAD Standardization Adam Morawiec Intitiative (ECSI) Fairchild Semiconductor Peter LaFlamme H.A.S Electronics Haruny Said IBM Richard Steinle, Kevin Jackson Intracon Design Ltd. Derek Laidlaw Philips Semiconductor Todd Andersen Scottish Electronics Robert Easson Manufacturing Center (SEMC) Seagate Vanessa Howard SGS-Thomson Philippe Lefevre Siemens Gerald Bannert, Bernhard Unger, Christian Marot, Miguel Hernandez, Gil Russell Summit Computer Systems Bob Davis* Sun Microsystems Lam Dong, Kevin Ko Symmetry Andy Hughes Tektronix Nassrin Ghahyasi Ultratest International Chris O'Connor Xilinx Susan Wu In the list above, attendees at the meeting are indicated by *. Principal members or other active members who have not attended are in parentheses. Participants who no longer are in the organization are in square brackets. Upcoming Meetings: The bridge numbers for future IBIS teleconferences are as follows: Date Bridge Number Reservation # Passcode October 15, 1998 IBIS Summit Meeting - No Phone November 6, 1998 TBD TBD TBD All meetings are 8:00 AM to 9:55 AM Pacific Time. We try to have agendas out 7 days before each Open Forum and meeting minutes out within 7 days after. When you call into the meeting, ask for the IBIS Open Forum hosted by Will Hobbs and give the reservation number and passcode. NOTE: "AR" = Action Required. -------------------------------- MINUTES ------------------------------------- INTRODUCTIONS AND MEETING QUORUM Bob Haller confirms that Digital Equipment is officially Compaq. Also, Larry Barnes stated that Symbios Logic is now part of LSI Logic. Bob Ross mentioned that the attendees list has been changed and that the EIA IBIS Open Forum membership now is transferred to these new companies and all their divisions world-wide. Bob Davis of Summit Computer Systems joined the meeting to discuss the IEEE Standard Component Data Sheet activity. MEMBERSHIP UPDATE AND TREASURER'S REPORT Bob Ross reported no membership or financial change. Syed Huq stated that Cisco Systems plans to become a full IBIS Open Forum member and is still working to get the paperwork from Patti Rusher. REVIEW OF MINUTES AND AR'S No corrections were noted. The ARs will be discussed during the meeting. MISCELLANY/ANNOUNCEMENTS None. PRESS AND WEB PAGE UPDATES Syed Huq stated that there is a Mitsubishi Roster update. Bob Haller and Larry Barnes will work with Syed to update their sites. Syed reports that the Models link has been restored, and a new Tools link was created to the ibischk3 executables. Syed uploaded linux ibischk2+ and ibischk3 executables. Syed also reports the turn around time for web updates should be 24 hours. NEW MODELS AVAILABLE, LIBRARY UPDATE Bob Ross reported some new links: Altera buffers: http://www.altera.com/html/atlas/ibis.html Pericom Semiconductor models: http://www.pericom.com/ibis Bob Ross mentioned that we still need to clean up the models directory under eda.org/pub/ibis and remove old subdirectories such as the National subdirectory. OPENS FOR NEW ISSUES None. INTERNATIONAL/EXTERNAL PROGRESS - IEC 62014-1 (IBIS Version 2.1) - Bob Ross stated that the IEC plenary session is scheduled in London on September 23-25, 1998. There might be some progress on moving IBIS Version 2.1 through some more steps. Bob does not think IBIS will be ratified at that meeting. - pr EIAJ ED-5302 Standard for I/O Interface Model for Integrated Circuits (IMIC) - Bob Ross mentioned that he might meet again with the committee chairman Dr. Hideki Fukuda in Monday, October 5, 1998 to discuss I/O model plans. Although this was set up as a private meeting, Bob Ross said others would be allowed to attend. - IEC 93/67/NP IBIS and EMC Simulation - Bob Ross reported that a Task Group meeting is planned on September 22, 1998 in Paris, prior to the IEC plenary meeting in London to prepare a New Work Item to be distributed at the IEC meeting in London. - JC-16.2 Subcommittee: Modeling and Test - Bob Ross initially reported that the joint IBIS and JEDEC meeting is planned for Wednesday, December 9, 1998 in San Diego. Bob noted that D.C. Sessions sent a note to the IBIS reflector on some recent JEDEC JC-16 and JC-42 activities. He indicates that the IBIS format is being considered for Specifying memory products. There is growing interested in the IBIS format, but may participants are not familiar with its details or how well it works with simulators. This is an opportunity for education. The note also stated that there is interest in the IBIS format for FET switches since they are now being used in DDR SDRAM models. D.C. gave further details. The memory manufacturers are not fully aware of what IBIS is or does. D.C. is helping to educate them that it is a format for a specification. If one manufacturer's IBIS specification is used as a basis for a memory specification, other manufacturers feel that their products may be cut out. D.C. also provided the JEDEC group information about VT and [Ramp] data. He also has recommended that they join the ibis-users reflector to become more familiar with IBIS. D.C. also stated that the memory manufacturers need to become familiar with IBIS related EDA tools. He referred to an offer by HyperLynx to provide a free tool to semiconductor vendors to assist in doing IBIS model development. Bob Haller stated that in response to a questionnaire sent out by Bruce Heilbrunn, several other EDA vendors indicated that they are offering free or low cost tools for IBIS model development. D.C. proposed that such tools and offers be put on the EIA IBIS Web Page. Then semiconductor vendors could use this for contact information. Bob Ross was concerned that this was not an appropriate use of the EIA IBIS Web page. It deals with vendor-specific relationships, and Bob suspects that in most cases such arrangements are not open-ended - the details and who gets the tools need to be worked out on a case-by-case basis directly. Arpad Muranyi supported making the information available. One possibility might be for EDA vendors to use the Roster page itself. Here the EDA vendors can provide information as part of their IBIS Support statement. Bob Ross noted that EDA vendors can notify D.C. directly (602-752-6545) and he can relay the information. The DDR SDRAM data sheet proposal was discussed. This is a double data rate SDRAM with data transfers rates up to 2 million transfers per second. Thus signal integrity concerns are an issue. The SSTL2 specification is designed for this. The data sheet proposal is to consider IBIS formatted envelop tables and data for the I/O characteristics and pin capacitance. The IBIS format provides the template for the specification. This will be voted on at the December JEDEC meeting - co-located with the IBIS Summit meeting. D.C. further elaborated that a compelling reason for the IBIS Version 3.1 extensions was to support FET switches in memories that are used for memory isolation. Bob Ross mentioned that he and D.C. need to work together on the logistics of the IBIS Summit meeting. D.C. strongly urges the IBIS participants to also participate in the JEDEC meetings as invited guests. So Bob and D.C. need to provide information on such meetings and how to become an "invited guest". Bob plans for such details to be sent out in the next few weeks for early planning. AR - Bob Ross and D.C. Sessions work on the logistics of the IBIS Summit Meeting / JEDEC JC-42 and JC-16.2 meetings and communicate the information using the IBIS reflectors. - IEEE Standard Component Data Sheet - Stephen Peters met on September 17, 1998 in San Jose with a small group of people concerning initial discussions to prepare a Project Authorization Request (PAR). Stephen summarized the Data Sheet contents. It is intended to be an electronic data sheet covering mechanical, thermal, electrical, timing, topological, VHDL descriptions, and architectural specification aspects. The Pinacles document is very large and is not the basis for this activity. The IBIS format could be expanded to include power consumption, EMI susceptibility, pin definition, short circuit currents, etc. Arpad Muranyi stated that the short circuit current information is already in the I/V tables. Stephen noted to the group that the BIRD (Buffer Issue Resolution Document) process is available to make IBIS changes. Stephen provided the email address for Bob Davis, Chair. of the committee as bob@scsi.com if people want more information directly. Bob Davis called in later and emphasized that the committee intends to look at and rely on existing standards where possible. It does not intent to invent new formats. A goal is transferrable information from an identifiable source. He wants a succinct and tight format. Bob provided his website at www.scsi.com under projects where more information and documents will be stored. IBIS (EAST) USERS GROUP MEETINGS Bob Haller reported on the September 3, 1998 meeting. It had good attendance with about 20 participants. IBIS Summit details were discussed. The Accuracy Specification is about one-half done as a rough draft. The test board is being built at Fairchild Semiconductor and should be available for display at the October IBIS Summit. The connector model BIRD is shaping up. Ed Sayre (NESA) and Joe Socha (Trilogic) are developing the IBIS training class and intend to present the outline and highlights at the IBIS Summit Meeting. Work is continuing on a DesignCon paper. OCTOBER 15, 1998 IBIS SUMMIT MEETING PLANS Bob Ross noted that a tentative schedule and further details were sent to the IBIS reflectors by Kathy Breda (NESA) who is coordinating the meeting. Bob Ross asked Bob Haller to report on the details. Bob Haller noted that there is interest in actual case studies. An opportunity exists for demonstrations in the back (including the test board demonstration). Bob Ross stated that he will include the tentative schedule in the minutes and reviewed it. He noted that it will probably change as more presentations are received and perhaps some time. Bob summarized the schedule so far as containing the following: A free two hour tutorial About six presentations A case study panel An optional Golf party from 4-6 PM for casual interaction (extra cost) Arpad Muranyi indicated interest in comparing a computer simulation model with silicon. The tentative schedule is below (adapted from the mailing): 8:30 A.M. Refreshments and informal gathering 9:00 Welcome, Introductions of participants - Ed Sayre (NESA) 9:15 General IBIS business - Bob Ross (Interconnectix/Mentor Graphics) 9:30 IBIS tutorial - Ed Sayre (NESA) /Joe Socha (Trilogic)/TBD 10:30 15 minute break 10:45 Continue with IBIS tutorial 11:30 IBIS Connector Model Definition BIRD - Fabrizio Zanella (EMC) 12:00 P.M. Lunch 1:00 Case Study Panel - Using IBIS Models Behavioral/IBIS modeling of a FET - Tay Ansari (Sun Microsystems) Bus using Cadence tools Measurement and simulations using various - Fabrizio Zanella Tools demonstrating and comparing 1) Measurements 2) Spice using spice model 2) vendors "A" and "B" using IBIS models IBIS Accuracy Specification - Robert Haller (Compaq Computer) IBIS Accuracy Test Board - Peter Laflamme (Fairchild Semi.) Comparison between SPICE and IBIS - Jinhua Chen (NESA) I/O device simulations MORE CASE STUDIES APPRECIATED! 2:00 Break 2:15 Using SPICE to Validate IBIS keywords - Bob Ross (Mentor Graphics) 3:15 PRESENTATION NEEDED! 3:45 Business Wrap-up 4:00 IBIS Summit Golf Outing - Cyprian Keys Golf Club (20 minutes from meeting location) Greens Fee ($12) to be paid by golfer. This is a Par 3, nine hole course, located twenty minutes from the meeting location. 284 East Temple St Bolyston MA 01505 508-869-9900 Bob Ross noted that the PCB Conference East is being held nearby Monday through Friday, October 12-16, 1998 in Marlborough, MA. So several PCB Conference attendees can also attend the IBIS Summit. Bob also noted that this was an excellent opportunity for some free IBIS training for local people and conference attendees. Kathy is still seeking closure on joint sponsorship issues. People should contact Kathy for documentation. As the emailing indicates, presenters and participants need to notify Kathy at breda@nesa.com EDITING COMMITTEE Bob Ross may upload a data model. The editing committee BNF AR remains. AR - Bob Ross generate and post a BNF for IBIS Version 3.0 (an IBIS Version 3.0 ratification AR). IBISCHK EXECUTABLES Bob Ross reported that the ibischk2+, Version 2.1.17 executables and the ibischk3 Version 3.1 executables have been uploaded on eda.org. Thanks to Chris Rokusek for creating these during the last meeting. Also, Linux executables created by Syed Huq have been uploaded as previously reported. So the AR is completed. VERSION 3.1/3.2 PARSER DEVELOPMENT Bob Ross plans to upload ver3_2b.ibs document in the work in progress directory with the resolution of BIRD53.1 below and some minor editorial corrections. As previously reported, Bob is still expecting the first version of ibischk3 for IBIS Version 3.2 by the end of September, 1998. Atul asked some questions about data value tests under the new [Submodel keyword. Bob responded with a set of tests that are similar to those of existing keywords. COOKBOOK No report from Stephen Peters. IBIS MODEL REVIEW COMMITTEE DISCUSSION Matthew Flora stated that Motorola has submitted several PECL Models for review by the Model Review Committee. Bob Ross believes several people have already responded. The committee is composed of EDA tool representatives, and each should respond privately to the model provider. The model provider is expected to consider the comments and make changes, if necessary. D.C. Sessions reported that VLSI Logic has revised its IBIS models. Potential reviewers need to notify D.C. directly by letter to get a copy of the new library for review. The letter should state that the reason is for review. Reviewed models are not to be given to anyone else. Matthew listed the companies doing the review: HyperLynx, Incases, Mentor Graphics, Viewlogic, and Veribest. He expects a new Cadence representative soon. Matthew still plans to send a note to the reflector. His contact address is listed at the end of these minutes. AR - Matthew Flora issue to the IBIS reflector a short writeup on the IBIS Model Review Committee. BIRD53.1 - IBIS File Character Set Geoffrey Ellis briefly summarized BIRD53.1 by stating that it limited the line terminators to those supported by UNIX (linefeed) and DOS (carriage return, line feed). Geoffrey and Matthew Flora worked together to produce BIRD53.1 in response to the editorial comments at the August 28, 1998 IBIS meeting. At that time we achieve a general consensus regarding approving BIRD53. Raj Raghuram requested that BIRD53.1 new text be read. Bob Ross read the text and called for a vote. BIRD53.1 was approved by unanimous vote. BUG29 - \n, \r. \r\n Line Terminators Need to be Handled As a result of the BIRD53.1 approval, BUG29 then is closed with the status "Will Not Fix". BUG29 had requested additional terminators besides the UNIX and DOS terminators above. BUG31 - Error for [Pulldown] Decreasing Current Should be Warning Bob Ross continued the discussion on BUG31 by stating that it remained open, but we did not decide what action to take. BUG31 requests that the [Pullup], [Pulldown], [GND Clamp], and [POWER Clamp] table endpoint test be changed so that it reports a Warning rather than an Error. The example in BUG29 is confusing and does not appear to have realistic data. Bob illustrated the intent with the case that a ground clamp might exist only in the receiver mode of an I/O buffer, but not appear in the driver mode. The only way to model this using IBIS Version 2.1 is to put a compensating current in the [Pulldown] table (and technically the [Pullup] table). Because of the dominance of the clamp currents, this work-around can create in an ibischk3 Error violation. Arpad Muranyi and others pointed out that maybe ibischk3 should test the summated tables. Then the endpoint violation would not be reported. Bob felt there was danger in approving this because the model would be deemed acceptable, but some simulators might still have problems dealing with this extreme case. So the model would have limited transportability. Matthew Flora wanted to look at the IBIS Specification further to understand better the problem. We did not achieve a resolution and will continue the discussion at a later meeting. IBIS REFLECTOR ISSUES No time remained for this discussion. NEXT MEETING: The meeting is the IBIS Summit Meeting on Thursday, October 15, 1998 at Boxboro, Massachusetts. No teleconference will be available. The following meeting will be on Friday, November 6, 1998 from 8:00 AM to 10:00 AM. ============================================================================== NOTES IBIS CHAIR: Bob Ross (503) 685-0732, Fax (503) 685-4897 bob_ross@mentorg.com Modeling Engineer, Interconnectix BU of Mentor Graphics 8005 S.W. Boeckman Road, Wilsonville, OR 97070 VICE CHAIR: Stephen Peters (503) 264-4108, Fax: (503) 264-4515 sjpeters@ichips.intel.com Senior Hardware Engineer, Intel Corporation M/S JF1-56 2111 NE 25th Ave. Hillsboro, Oregon 97124-5961 SECRETARY: Matthew Flora (425) 869-2320, Fax: (425) 881-1008 mbflora@hyperlynx.com Senior Engineer, HyperLynx, Inc. 17641 NE 67th Court Redmond, WA 98052 LIBRARIAN: Jon Powell (805) 988-8250, Fax: (805) 988-8259 jonp@qdt.com Senior Scientist, Viewlogic (formerly Quad Design) 1385 Del Norte Rd., Camarillo, CA 93010 This meeting was conducted in accordance with the EIA Legal Guides and EIA Manual of Organization and Procedure. The following e-mail addresses are used: ibis-request@eda.org To join, change, or drop from either the IBIS Open Forum Reflector (ibis@eda.org), the IBIS Users' Group Reflector (ibis-users@eda.org) or both. State your request. ibis-info@eda.org To obtain general information about IBIS, to ask specific questions for individual response, and to inquire about joining the EIA-IBIS Open Forum as a full Member. ibis@eda.org To send a message to the general IBIS Open Forum Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS Standardization business and future IBIS technical enhancements. Job posting information is not permitted. ibis-users@eda.org To send a message to the IBIS Users' Group Reflector. This is used mostly for IBIS clarification, current modeling issues, and general user concerns. Job posting information is not permitted. ibischk-bug@eda.org To report ibischk2 parser bugs. The Bug Report Form Resides on eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/ibischk/bugform.txt along with reported bugs. To report s2ibis, s2ibis2 and s2iplt bugs, use the Bug Report Forms which reside under eda.org in /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis/bugs2i.txt, /pub/ibis/bugs/s2ibis2/bugs2i2.txt, & /pub/ibis/bugs/s2iplt/bugsplt.txt respectively. Information on IBIS technical contents, IBIS participants, and actual IBIS models are available on the IBIS Home page found by selecting the Electronic Information Group under: http://www.eia.org Check the pub/ibis directory on eda.org for more information on previous discussions and results. You can get on via FTP anonymous. ============================================================================== Matthew Flora IBIS Open Forum Secretary (425) 869-2320 PH (425) 881-1008 FAX mbflora@hyperlynx.com HyperLynx, 17641 NE 67th Court, Redmond, WA 98052 USA From owner-ibis Fri Sep 25 15:20:17 1998 Received: from emcmail.lss.emc.com (emcmail.lss.emc.com [168.159.48.78]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id PAA14849 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 1998 15:20:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fishbowl02.emc.com (fishbowl02.lss.emc.com [168.159.48.62]) by emcmail.lss.emc.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA25282 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 1998 18:14:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: by fishbowl02.emc.com with VINES-ISMTP; Fri, 25 Sep 98 18:15:34 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Sep 98 18:11:08 -0400 Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 (Normal) To: From: "fabrizio zanella" Reply-To: Errors-to: Subject: IBIS model of switches X-Incognito-SN: 1467 X-Incognito-Version: 4.11.23 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I have a question regarding CBT switches. I know that IBIS version 3.1 release includes modeling of FET switches, but does anyone know how soon SI simulator companies will support v3.1 IBIS models so we can begins simulating nets with switches? thanks, Fabrizio Zanella EMC corporation fzanella@emc.com 508-435-2075, x4645 fax 508-435-8949 From owner-ibis Fri Sep 25 17:15:51 1998 Received: from vlsi1.3dfx.com (vlsi1.3dfx.com [205.158.17.41]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id RAA15090 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 1998 17:15:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from exchange2.3dfx.com (exchange2.3dfx.com [205.158.17.53]) by vlsi1.3dfx.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA04677 for ; Fri, 25 Sep 1998 17:11:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by exchange2.3dfx.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Fri, 25 Sep 1998 17:10:08 -0700 Message-ID: <4F7525F7D14CD211AABD00A0C9DED90102A61C@exchange2.3dfx.com> From: Elias Lozano To: ibis@vhdl.org Cc: Elias Lozano Subject: 3v5 tolerant IO's for IBIS model generation Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1998 17:10:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi, I would like to find out if any one has an example of a 5V tolerant 3.3v volt IO IBIS model generation. It seems to me that the IBIS model is not as straight forward when mixed voltages are used in the IO and not having direct pull-down/pull-up diodes. Any information or examples would be really helpful. Thanks a lot Elias From owner-ibis Sat Sep 26 14:36:29 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id OAA16306 for ; Sat, 26 Sep 1998 14:36:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id OAA26080; Sat, 26 Sep 1998 14:31:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id OAA20352; Sat, 26 Sep 1998 14:31:46 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA02482; Sat, 26 Sep 98 14:31:44 PDT Date: Sat, 26 Sep 98 14:31:44 PDT Message-Id: <9809262131.AA02482@bob> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: UNOFFICIAL IBIS VERSION 3.2B To All: An UNOFFICIAL IBIS ver3_2b.ibs has been uploaded in eda.org/pub/ibis/wip. It contains approved BIRD53.1 and some editorial corrections. Also one of the samples under eda.org/pub/ibis/samples/ver3.2 has been corrected. Bob Ross Interconnectix/Mentor Graphics From owner-ibis Mon Sep 28 08:05:26 1998 Received: from hebe.or.intel.com (hebe.or.intel.com [134.134.248.4]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id IAA19166 for ; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 08:05:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orsmsx26.jf.intel.com (orsmsx26.jf.intel.com [192.168.75.26]) by hebe.or.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA11995; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 08:10:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199809281510.IAA11995@hebe.or.intel.com> Received: by ORSMSX26 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 08:03:32 -0700 From: "Muranyi, Arpad" To: "\"ibis@vhdl.org\" " Cc: "\"Elias Lozano\" " Subject: RE: 3v5 tolerant IO's for IBIS model generation Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1998 07:59:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Elias, We made many 5 volt tolerant 3.3 volt models. It is really not that difficult to make them. You can use the pullup reference voltage keyword at 3.3 V and the power clamp reference voltage keyword for the 5 V calmps. Sweep the device 5 volt relative when it is 3-stated, and sweep it 3.3 relative when it is driving high. This is to reflect which rail the pullup and the clamp is connected to, but you actually don't even have to do this if you don't care about how the currents flow through the package. In that case, you can sweep everything 3.3 relative, but don't be surprised that in the 3-state mode your clamps will show up 1.7 volts shifted compared with the way they normally look like. Arpad Muranyi Intel Corporation ============================================================================ ==== Hi, I would like to find out if any one has an example of a 5V tolerant 3.3v volt IO IBIS model generation. It seems to me that the IBIS model is not as straight forward when mixed voltages are used in the IO and not having direct pull-down/pull-up diodes. Any information or examples would be really helpful. Thanks a lot Elias From owner-ibis Mon Sep 28 19:27:17 1998 Received: from newsgw.mentorg.com (newsgw.mentorg.com [192.94.38.66]) by server.eda.org (8.8.5/8.8.3) with ESMTP id TAA20731 for ; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 19:27:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emicx.wv.mentorg.com by newsgw.mentorg.com (8.8.8/CF5.40F) id TAA17345; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 19:22:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bob by emicx.wv.mentorg.com (8.7.5/CF5.38R) id TAA08128; Mon, 28 Sep 1998 19:22:30 -0700 (PDT) From: bobr@emicx.mentorg.com (Bob Ross) Received: by bob (4.1/CF5.23L) id AA16511; Mon, 28 Sep 98 19:22:30 PDT Date: Mon, 28 Sep 98 19:22:30 PDT Message-Id: <9809290222.AA16511@bob> To: ibis@eda.org Subject: IBIS BIRD54 - PACKAGE MODEL CORRECTIONS To All: BIRD54 corrects a mistake in the IBIS Version 3.1 standard which causes the ibischk3 parser to not process transmission line package models as originally intended. A (note 1) associated with a listing of keywords needed to be revised. BIRD54 covers this in more detail. BIRD54 needs to be considered and approved before Version 3.2 can be released. Bob Ross Interconnectix/Mentor Graphics ****************************************************************************** ****************************************************************************** BIRD ID#: 54 ISSUE TITLE: Package Model Corrections REQUESTER: Bob Ross, Mentor Graphics, Stephen Peters, Intel Corporation DATE SUBMITTED: September 28, 1998 DATE ACCEPTED BY IBIS OPEN FORUM: Pending ****************************************************************************** ****************************************************************************** STATEMENT OF THE ISSUE: In compliance with an editorial mistake in the Package Modeling Section the ibischk3 parser requires the Matrix Models defined even for tranmission line sections. ****************************************************************************** STATEMENT OF THE RESOLVED SPECIFICATIONS: The Note (1) and list of required keywords needs to be corrected. The original section is shown: |============================================================================= |============================================================================= | | Section 7 | | P A C K A G E M O D E L I N G | |============================================================================= |============================================================================= | | The [Package Model] keyword is optional. If more than the default RLC | package model is desired, use the [Define Package Model] keyword. | | Use the [Package Model] keyword within a [Component] to indicate the package | model for that component. The specification permits .ibs files to contain | the following additional list of package model keywords. Note that the | actual package models can be in a separate .pkg file or | can exist in the IBIS files between the [Define Package Model]... | [End Package Model] keywords for each package model that is defined. For | reference, these keywords are listed below. Full descriptions follow. | Simulators that do not support these keywords will ignore all entries | between the [Define Package Model] and [End Package Model] keywords. | | [Define Package Model] Required if the [Package Model] keyword is used | [Manufacturer] (note 1) | [OEM] (note 1) | [Description] (note 1) | [Number Of Sections] (Optional) | [Number Of Pins] (note 1) | [Pin Numbers] (note 1) | [Model Data] (note 1) | [Resistance Matrix] Optional | [Inductance Matrix] (note 1) | [Capacitance Matrix] (note 1) | [Bandwidth] Required (for Banded_matrix matrices only) | [Row] (note 1) | [End Model Data] (note 1) | [End Package Model] (note 1) | | (note 1) Required when the [Define Package Model] keyword is used | The list of keywords is revised when adding (note 2) and (note 3): | [Define Package Model] Required if the [Package Model] keyword is used | [Manufacturer] (note 1) | [OEM] (note 1) | [Description] (note 1) | [Number Of Sections] (note 2) | [Number Of Pins] (note 1) | [Pin Numbers] (note 1) | [Model Data] (note 2) | [Resistance Matrix] Optional when [Model Data] is used | [Inductance Matrix] (note 3) | [Capacitance Matrix] (note 3) | [Bandwidth] Required (for Banded_matrix matrices only) | [Row] (note 3) | [End Model Data] (note 2) | [End Package Model] (note 1) | | (note 1) Required when the [Define Package Model] keyword is used | (note 2) Either the [Number or Sections] or the [Model Data]/[End Model Data] | keywords are required. Note that [Number of Sections] and the | [Model Data]/[End Model Data] keywords are mutually exclusive. | (note 3) Required when the [Define Package Model] keyword is used | and the [Number Of Sections] keyword is not used. | ****************************************************************************** ANALYSIS PATH/DATA THAT LED TO SPECIFICATION: In IBIS Version 2.1, the [Pin Numbers] keyword list the pins and their order to be used with the [Define Model] keyword that supported the coupled matrix keywords. (note 1) documented all of the required keywords in this context. As a result of the BIRD28.3 and BIRD37.3 evolution, the syntax for the listing of pins under [Pin Numbers] was extended to include subparameter sections for lumped and distributed elements. The [Number Of Sections] keyword was introduced. (It had as stronger need when cascaded coupled matrix sections were being discussed). The final resolution was to support both the matrix format of Version 2.1 and also the uncoupled lumped and distributed elements on the [Pin Numbers] WITHOUT the matrix format of Version 2.1. The [Number Of Sections] keyword provided the flag that [Pin Numbers] list now had additional elements. The changed and extended keyword meanings are documented with the Package Modeling section. However, (note 1) was not properly reviewed when the [Number of Sections] keyword was added to the list for IBIS Version 3.0. Consequently, the [Define Model] keyword appeared to be required even when uncoupled sections were documented. (The ibischk3, version 3.1.0 parser requires this incorrect interpretation.) BIRD54 corrects this editorial mistake by adding (note 2) and (note 3). These notes document what is required when the package model has just uncoupled lumped or distributed sections liste under the [Pin Numbers] keyword. It was never the intention to support the combination of BOTH partial matrix descriptions for some pins and lumped or distributed sections for other pins. ****************************************************************************** ANY OTHER BACKGROUND INFORMATION: See BIRD28.3 and BIRD37.3 under http://www.eda.org/pub/ibis/birds. ******************************************************************************